New potential user requesting advice please
I have an old boiler (20 year old warm flow 70/90 bluebird) which runs off oil. It’s working fine as it’s been serviced regularly.
I have a 2 story house with separate heating zones for upstairs, downstairs as well as a separate hot water feed.
This is controlled via a Drayton MITime and the thermostats both upstairs and downstairs are old style twist for temperature models
The upstairs thermostat seems to be stuck on permanently so even when the timing clock is switched off the heat is still going on upstairs and the boiler is firing and burning oil.
I would like to change my wired thermostats upstairs and downstairs to the new Tado versions, but I am not sure what I need!
When I change the thermostat upstairs and downstairs, do I need to add on a new timing unit to the Drayton I currently have?
Would it be worth while adding on radiator TRV valves at the same time?
Apologies for all the questions. I used to think I was quite tech savvy, but maybe not!
Thank you in advance
Comments
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Hi. Given your statement so far, it looks like you have either:
- 3 x two port motorised valves, one feeding hot water, one for CH for upstairs, one for CH for downstairs. Each would have its own thermostat.
- Or 1 x 3 port motorised valve, serving HW and CH, or both and when it opens up to supply CH, that defaults to either downstairs or upstairs; then you have an additional two port valve which handles the floor not handled by the first three port valve. Each would have its own thermostat again.
Your boiler installation guide is here: 1332429994StandardManual992.pdf. Note page 15. The six way socket handles the thermostat triggers and programmer. However I suspect that the wires from that socket go to a wiring centre, which may be about 9" x 7" x 2.5" in size- and that will need to be located.
So some questions:
- Please let us know which you have of the above, because it means you either have an S PLus plan (the first option) or a combination of Y plan and S plan (the second option).
- In both scenarios you either have a three channel programmer (you didnt state which exact model), or a two channel programme. Which do you have?
- Your system probably has a wiring centre, with a large chocolate strip handling the wiring to the valves, the boiler and the thermostats. Could you let us know what product that is? It helps later.
- Do you have underfloor heating in place?
- Is yout house large, or have thick walls, or very large rooms, or more than 8 rooms?
- How comfortable are you doing your own wiring and double checking the wiring thats there?
- Do you have either a multimeter and/or an electrical testing screwdriver?
Almost there.
- You will need to buy at least the following:
- Two wired smart thermostats
- Extension kit with the internet bridge.
(This will get you started, however if you have TRVs on your radiators, it is worth also investing in smart radiator valve heads- we can discuss that later)
2. The size and complexity of your house will determine whether you need a V3+ system, or an X system. Given the low output level of your boiler I suspect that this house isnt a giant and will probably work well with the tado V3+ series.
3. You need to plan for between 3 hours and one whole day of tracing, making sense of, and replacing the old kit with the new kit.
Come back with the answers to those questions. We should be able to help from there.
Dont work for Tado, am not a professional sparkie or plumber. Just helping here.
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@ross_annett Welcome Ross. Good advice from @policywonk. When you say the "upstairs thermostat seems to be stuck on permanently", assuming your two thermostats control zone valves on the plumbing, I'd be very suspicious that one of the valves is siezed, resulting in the boiler always 'ON'.
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Wow. So much information there is very helpful from @policywonk
I’m going to try and attach images here to hopefully let you see what I have. This will be my thermostat upstairs (downstairs is the same).
These are purely for the heating element
I’ve added a photo of my timer. The water is triggered from this and the only thermostat for the water is on the pressurised system in the hot press / airing cupboard
I’ve also added a photo of the motorised valve which opens (and was sticking!) which is upstairs in the airing cupboard.
I’ve got one of these downstairs also (I had tk change the motorised valve downstairs years ago so I remember it)
Do you think I’m missing something else somewhere?
Thank you so much again for your brilliant help and advice
@wateroakley - you’ve summed it up better than me. That’s what the valve I’m sharing the image of should be
[url=https://postimg.cc/WDb0rK3p][img]https://i.postimg.cc/d0GnMccC/IMG-5179.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=https://postimg.cc/sQbWkgJ1][img]https://i.postimg.cc/3NxZDy4j/IMG-5180.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=https://postimg.cc/TpMmQhw4][img]https://i.postimg.cc/rFzJVrLM/IMG-5182.jpg[/img][/url]0 -
I’ve tried to reply a couple of times but it’s been moderated?0
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[url=https://postimg.cc/WDb0rK3p][img]https://i.postimg.cc/d0GnMccC/IMG-5179.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=https://postimg.cc/sQbWkgJ1][img]https://i.postimg.cc/3NxZDy4j/IMG-5180.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=https://postimg.cc/TpMmQhw4][img]https://i.postimg.cc/rFzJVrLM/IMG-5182.jpg[/img][/url]0 -
https://i.postimg.cc/d0GnMccC/IMG-5179.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/3NxZDy4j/IMG-5180.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/rFzJVrLM/IMG-5182.jpg0 -
Thank you for the help and advice that I have been shown here already.
I have tried to upload photographs of the motorised valve, the current thermostats as well as the timer/control unit that is currently an operation
From what I can remember, although I must be wrong reading the great description above I assumed I only had two motorised valves in my house - one upstairs and one downstairs
Given the information above as well as the photographs I have tried to upload here, can I assume that I am missing something?
Is there anything else? I should be looking for 2 to help me make the change?
Thank you so much again for all of your help and advice @policywonk and @wateroakley0 -
You've given us this:
1. Photo of a three port valve. Suggests that there is a Y plan in the scheme. However from your first description there is another valve, not yet photographed, probably handling one of the floors.
2. Photo of a simple thermostat. Where is that? Is there another one on the other floor?
3. Photo of a Drayton T742R, which can control upto four seperate channels. You need to know whether it has been setup to manage 2 or 3 channels.
Somewhere not far from the three port valve should be the wiring centre.
You said that you once thought of yourself as tech savvy. Well, it isnt difficult, but this website:
https://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/Central_Heating_Controls_and_Zoning - provides drawings of Y Plans, S Plans, etc. Spend some time studying the wiring and look for the wiring centre in your home. If you feel up to working it out, you'll have help here.
Now if you aren't comfortable working out the wiring, you may need to consider hiring an electrician for anything up to a day. Given @wateroakley 's comment, there is an electrical fault which may need to be traced to the motorised valve, either the one that's been photographed, or another...
However if you want to challenge yourself and can make the time, this can be handled.
Let us have the answers to these remaining questions and we will help.0 -
Hello @ross_annett Sorry to hear that your earlier post has disapppered. The post has not been moderated. It's more likely that the host site had a wobbly, which very occasionally happens for me when I've made multiple edits.
I've posted your three pictures here. (Easiest from a web browser). Looking at the pictures, it's not quite enpugh to give a definitive answer …
- The Drayton is a four-channel programmer, simple relay ON/OFF. So, two CH and one HW?
- Is this a mid-position 3-port motorised valve or a two-port IN/OUT ? (It looks two-port, but the motor head 50021200 supports both?).
- Is this the only motorised zone valve?
- What is the wiring centre and do you have picture of it?
- The thermostat appears to be simple ON/OFF, COM and NO.
- Is the other thermosat the same?
Before moving to Tado, I'd strongly recommend that you first figure out why the upstairs is always 'ON'. Otherwise, you'll start fault-finding with a new install, not knowing whether you're fixing a new install or still looking for the old fault.
HTH.
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Wow. So much information there is very helpful from @policywonk
I’m going to try and attach images here to hopefully let you see what I have. This will be my thermostat upstairs (downstairs is the same).
These are purely for the heating element
I’ve added a photo of my timer. The water is triggered from this and the only thermostat for the water is on the pressurised system in the hot press / airing cupboard
I’ve also added a photo of the motorised valve which opens (and was sticking!) which is upstairs in the airing cupboard.
I’ve got one of these downstairs also (I had tk change the motorised valve downstairs years ago so I remember it)
Do you think I’m missing something else somewhere?
Thank you so much again for your brilliant help and advice
@wateroakley - you’ve summed it up better than me. That’s what the valve I’m sharing the image of should be0
