Tado kit with central heating

Bapep

Hi everyone, in my house I have 4 radiators and 2 towel warmers with mechanical thermostatic valves and I can switch on the heating with a thermostat always in my house. Usually my use was with manual switch, for a few hours,in the afternoon/evening so as to heat the rooms but the central heating switch off from 23:00 pm to 05:00 am.

With my old thermostat I can also to time the heating and set it with min or max temperature, but I always use manual mode with on/off. Now I purchased a Tado kit with valves, bridge and thermostat.Can you tell me what I must install and how to configuration these components to save money? thanks

policywonk

1. Use ordinary TRVs on the towel rads and use the lockshield side to determine how quickly they respond.
2. What boiler model do you have. What are the thermosats currently in place?
3. Is there a Y plan or S plan or is it a combi?

Bapep

Why ordinary TRV on the towel rads? now there are manual valve but not termostatich on that. I bought 4 Tado Valvs for the radiator in the rooms and I can put their classic trv on the towel rads.
The boiler is centralized and it's a Saunier Duval. I have my personal thermostat in my home in a small hallway between the room with rads.
I don't understand your third answer.sorry

policywonk

Basic TRVs in bathrooms do not get overwhelmed by humidity in the same way, turning off early and leaving towels wet for longer in the way that smart trvs do.

In the question about S or Y or combie, i needed to know whether you boiler maintains a seperate hot water tank serving the taps and or whether there are one or more motorised zone valves in place. Your answers to these questions determine whether you will need
a) wired thermostats, or just wireless ones
b) an extension kit, or just CH controls.
Hope this makes things more clear.

Bapep

ok, it's a little bit difficult answer to this for me but I try. There are two boiler working for the heating in the winter and help solar panel for hot water in all weather, to warm general water tank, with inverter pump and single flow that branches off in the apartments.
Every apartments have a Caleffi Kwh meter on the water flow/return for to split the gas bill.
The thermostat in my home for the radiators is wired with 3 wires ( NC COM NA). I hope give you right informations for my question. Sorry but I'm Italian and my English is not perfect.

policywonk

If you wish we can take this slowly.

FIRST. There is a strong possibilty that I have misunderstood your configuration. Are you saying that the boiler is not in your apartment and is beyond your control, and furthermore, that all you can control is the thermostat on your wall and those on your radiators?

If that is correct please provide us the exact model of the existing thermostat, and also confirm this:
* when you stated that the wires were joined to these terminals: NC COM NA
* that you might have *actually* meant to write NC (normally closed), COM (common) and NO (normally open).

SECOND. Now - only if you are in direct control of the boiler - there is some more information we need. There seem to be many models of that brand of boiler. Could you provide us with the exact model identity? The wiring to activate the boiler does change between some of the Saunier Duval models.
I hope this is clearer for you.

Bapep

Ok I try to recap. The twin boilers of Saunier Duval (model Micra 4) are centralized in a residential community of eight house. In my house I have my 4 rads and the 2 towel rads and my thermostat (Tecnoswitch CR215). I can switch on the heating in my house with that. (but is avalaible only from 5:00 am to 23:00 pm)
I think the thermostat in my house open and close a spring zone valve (she's also in my house) to control the flow of heat water to rads that come from centralized boilers.

policywonk

Have examined the installation instructions of the Technoswitch CR215. According to those,

• PIN 5 (NAMED N/A) is the equivalent on the Tado, of Normally Open or NC.
• PIN 6 (NAMED COM) is the equivalent on the Tado of COM
• PIN 7 (NAMED NO) is the equivalent on the Tado of NO

The instructions say this device can handle switch 250 volts, however internet searches suggest it can be used as a low voltage switch as well. The thermostat is designed to not use the energy from those wires to power itself. So we do not know whether this uses real LIVE voltage, ie 230v in Italy. This thermostat is normally installed as part of an entire building management system which reports faults and interruptions to a central console. So we need to be careful.

As we do not yet know whether that thermostat directly controls the motorised valve for your home, it is important to do the following:

a) Get hold of an electrician's multimeter and measure the volt readings on COM, N/A and NO. If two of them are 200 volts or higher, the third reading under 30 volts, then we can reasonably conclude that this was installed to operate as simple LIVE switch.

• If so, get insulated gloves, ensure that you do not get electrocuted,
• Remove the front of the device.
• Label the wires before they are removed.
• Fit the Wired Tado thermostat backplate and wire the cables in using the list given above.
• Usie the Tado application, to scan and register the Tado thermostat QR code into your account.
• Inform the application that the Tado wired thermostat is set up in RELAY mode.
• Place the front of the Tado thermostat onto its backplate on the wall.
• Try it out. It should work.

b) If the volts at COM is below 200 volts, then it is important to contact the administrators of your house and clarify the switching system, come back here and we can try again.

If (a) worked then the next task is to set your heating timetable and prove that it works.

• If it doesnt, come back here.
• If it does, then start adding the Smart thermostatic valve heads on your chosen radiators and add them to the Tado application, set the temperatures and all should be well.

If it did not, come back here with what you discovered.

Good luck.

Bapep

Thanks. I will try this. I forgot to say you that in my home the current thermostat is connect to a Caleffi module model 79671C which regulate the flow of hot water at the rads. Can this give me some problema with Tado Thermostat?

policywonk

@Bapep

Hi. According to the internet search - you may want to check this with those people who maintain your building - the Caleffi 79671C seems to be a three way motorised valve. I cannot seem to find the installation guide anywhere for it, or get a translation of it. However it is most often installed as part of a large building management system, and the valve itself is also capable of being remotely triggered at a central location. This brings some challenges.

Before you install the Tado, it would help to obtain clarification on whether the people managing your building would create a drama if you replaced the thermostat with a Tado, with the basic relay configuration that the Tado can offer to make life simple for you. If the building managers give you problems, then you will need an heating services specialist to study it all and make a formal recommendation. Am sorry @Bapep politics with a building management team can be very tiring.

Did you manage to get the volt readings on COM NA and NO on the existing thermostat? What are they?

Keep coming back here. We may still be able to make this work.

Bapep

No problem with the managing of the building. I bought Tado for install it in the same mode of my thermostat cr215 with the only difference to monitoring the heating and the valve with the app and switch on and off with wifi in remote mode.Tomorrow I will try to get the volts on the wires.

Bapep

I confirm that on NC/NA I read 220v and on COM 0v

policywonk

@Bapep
You sure?
COM= 0 volts
NA= 220 volts.
NO= ? Did you forget to measure this?

This does not, for now, make sense.

* If you are not sure please have an electrician check the reading.
* If you are sure please talk to the building management engineer's. Need to understand why COM is Zero and NA is 220v.

I'm expecting COM to be 220v if it was fitted professionally and need to know why it is not. You also need to know the answer before daring to play with that thermostat.

policywonk

Am suspecting that am experienced local electrician who works on your building will look at this exchange, laugh and give you a simple answer. He will know something that I don't myself see in this exchange.

policywonk

@Bapep

Do you have any progress?